Without a hint of foreplay, we go deep into the gaping heart chakra of my man Cory Allen, finding out why Ayahuasca told him he no longer needed to be a vegetarian, and other trifles-- like what the source code of the universe looks like. Dare I say it might even be the best Cory Allen podcast to date?
AUBREY: Yo, yo, what's going on, my friends? So, here we are today with my man, Cory Allen. And we had the, I think it was the pleasure for you, but I don't know if it was the pleasure for me throughout the whole trip. But the incredible value of the experience of sharing that ayahuasca journey down there in Peru with Gandalf himself. And Cory is here to blow your fucking mind with some stories, really. I already laid mine out there and that was like the junior varsity. I tell those stories of Cory, he goes "Oh, that was really cute experience."CORY: It was sweet. No, all experiences, all stories are valid. AUBREY: We know, we know. We're just kidding. But man, welcome and I haven't got to see you really since we got back from Peru. And I see you're looking great. I was just commenting on that, you're looking fit. CORY: Thanks. AUBREY: Looking good to go. And then we figured out the reason why. CORY: That's right. I started eating meat after seven years. AUBREY:O h, shit. You see that? You go down, you do ayahuasca, you think, "Oh, I'm going to come back all conscious, vegetarian." No, this motherfucker went down a vegetarian and he came back eating barbecue for breakfast and steak twice, two days in a row and steak for dinner, alright? So, don't give me any of this shit about, "Oh, you're going to turn into a vegan now?" No, ayahuasca tells you some real shit. Sometimes, right? CORY: It had the opposite effect on me, man. Shit. The idea that people think that you're going to go down there and become vegetarian or whatnot. If people think or say that, they're really truly missing the point of the entire thing. Because something like that is such a skin deep, just insignificant part of the packaging. That's like the shallowest layer of a person's individuality. AUBREY: Agreed. CORY: Whenever in truth, the entire personality could be considered irrelevant in the big picture by some. Some of those people would be a person that's in this chair. AUBREY: Cory, when you make love to someone, do you just go straight in? Or do you flirt a little bit? Do you like make out with them? Because every time we have this podcast, you just go straight in. I mean, you go into the anal of consciousness like right off the bat. I mean, you don't even warm anything up. You got to ease these people in. We're talking about vegetarian-- CORY: Put a pinky in first. AUBREY: Yeah, relax. Kiss the neck, blow in the ear, I don't know, whatever your move is. CORY: Here's the way I look at it, we have an infinite amount of time, and to me, that's also the balance that, just having no time. So there's no time like now, man. Just get going. I don't want to kill these people with small talk, man. AUBREY: But I do want to hear what was... So, we're down there doing ayahuasca. What was the specific realization that allowed you to think, "You know what, it's cool, I'm going to have some meat." CORY: Well, I think that during one of my peak ceremonies, we'll call them, the highest, deepest and most rich and full of information. I was shown the structure of how everything in the cosmos is connected, it showed me the source of the universe which, talking about hopping right into it, that's one of the greatest truths and bits of information I was given was, showing me the source from which all things flow. What that looked like was just billions of tiny neon mandalas. Like if the entire sky was nothing but neon mandalas. Like think about the matrix, but multilayered and multicolored and flowing in every direction, as far as the eye could see, complete blackness around you in every XYZ axis, except for the sky. And it was just flowing like this river, and it was all bits of code. It showed me and told me how that each individual, each living thing has got a piece of this mandala code inside of them. And that code is made out of-- AUBREY: Now, a piece of this code or are they entirely comprised of this code? CORY: There's like a line of code inside of it, right? And their body is like a container. It's like a driver which is unaware that they have a passenger in most cases. Most people live their entire lives without knowing that they have this code of the cosmos inside of them. And what that source is comprised of is pure energy and love. And love not in the sense of the way like I love Chinese food, and I love that couch. But it's a word, a symbol with our mouth we've applied to a phenomenon which transcends our ability to put real language and words on it. It's the feeling, that energy that we're talking about. When we say love, that magnetic thing that kicks in inside of us. It's that. And it showed me how that those pieces of code have been going on for eons. And that whenever somebody, a human, an animal or a plant, any of those things are living, that a piece of this code is issued to them from the source. They live their life, and through the act of living, they help perfect that code. And when they drop their body or their container is gone, the code returns to the source and is issued into another container. And so, that's why you'll meet some people who seem incredibly wise and incredibly well aged whenever they're in their early 30s or early 20s, or something. And you'll meet some people in their 40s which seem like babies. It's because it's this new fresh code, right? Well, new to them, not new to us, per se. So, in that, that did a lot of things. Not that I had-- AUBREY: You think? You think that did a lot of things? I'd hope so. "That was interesting, now back to fucking World of Warcraft. Let's just keep this going." No, [inaudible 06:04]. CORY: Now, a lot of things, of course, but one of the things is that, I worked and dealt with the idea of death a lot over the last decade or 15 years. But I had no problem with it, I actually kind of looked forward to it, because I'm just excited about the idea of it. I'm not actively seeking it, but I'm okay with the idea. Because I know it's another layer to the fabric of the Cosmos. And I'm excited to see what that layer is. And I have no fear about the idea of me... Like, if you're in a plane, and you look down and you see a city, you think about yourself not being around anymore, you'd be pretty hard to go, "That's not going to work without me." It's all going to be fine without you. AUBREY: I remember, do you remember that moment where you realized your own mortality? I remember mine very clearly. CORY: Oh, for sure. AUBREY: I was sitting in a hotel room in New York, and I was looking down at all the taxi cabs. And I came to term with the fact that I was going to die. And I just kept looking, and the only comfort I had was like, "Well, I guess everybody's going to die." But it was still like this really melancholy kind of sad thought that I was going to die, and everybody was going to die, everybody I knew was going to die. Really kind of weird thing that everybody has to cross at a certain point. And then hopefully, through some of these journeys or whatever practice you have, transcend those fears that are a bit juvenile in nature. CORY: Totally. And I look at it also as like, I had the same feeling. It's like, "Holy shit, right? Everyone was born, everyone had to be born. Holy fuck, what a harrowing experience that was. So, really just that last bit of like, safety net I had in my brain about the idea of death, it was like, you already on an intellectual level had sorted it out, and were comfortable with it. But on a heart level here, it's all fine. This thing is this recycling, perpetually generating process that's perfect. And I'm leaving out bit of details here, but also realized that plants were psychic during this experience. And so, seeing that, it-- AUBREY: You'll have to explain that at some point, but continue with the thread. Footnote, everybody: plants are psychic. We'll get back to that. AUBREY: Put that in your pocket. CORY: So, I really came to terms with the idea that it's this giant, perfect system, right? My compassion was directed so much more at the individual, and I would almost have an anxiety about people. Whenever I could feel that they were feeling a certain way, I could feel their uncomfortableness, their sadness, their hopelessness, or any of that, I would almost have an obsessive compulsive urge to try and help with that, and give my energy towards them to make them feel more comfortable, and so forth. And that really was lifted because whenever I saw that, that system, it made me see everything on a layer above the individual, and made me see how it's this giant source that's feeding into everyone. Like there's a string going, it's like a little marionette show, a string going into everyone. And I became more interested in honoring-- AUBREY: A marionette show that maintains free will. CORY: Right, right, right. So that's a whole other podcast. I think we can choose our choices. I think, because that's what free will is. AUBREY: Well, I said free will, choosing your choices. CORY: So, in that, we could go on that forever. But in that, whenever I came back from Peru, the idea, that repulsion I had to eating meat, and it wasn't like I didn't want to eat meat. It was something that just slowly over time, the more I thought about it, the more it got to where I was like, I can't like... I'd try and put it in my mouth and it would make me feel nauseous. It wasn't like one day I decided I'm going to be a vegetarian, I just started eating it... Slowly kind of phased it out. And then one day, I just stopped, and was like, alright, well fuck it. But whenever I got back, that feeling, that block was gone, that wall was gone. And so I was like, alright, well, let's try some fish. AUBREY: So, that's the long road to becoming not a vegetarian. CORY: Yeah, yeah. AUBREY: So, first go back to the source code of the universe. And then maybe you can enjoy a steak. CORY: I recommend that for everyone regardless. AUBREY: No, that's really interesting what you say. The way that you saw it confirms a lot of other things that I've seen in a lot of other traditions where they basically talk about that universal force. They don't usually use it in terms of code, but they'll say, source and then-- CORY: As a piece of source... AUBREY: Yeah, there's that piece of source or piece of God, which is a really challenging word. People freak out when you say that. But, so you say source. So, a piece of source in all of us, that's all the same, always connected but all the same our own and that's that dichotomy that always exists. As above so below, what is inside so without, that kind of concept. And, cool that you're able to actually see it visually represented. Neon mandalas. CORY: That was one of the ones where I was sitting in kind of a slumped-over lotus posture. And just seeing all this, I was muttering to myself under my breath, I was just going, "What the fuck?" I was like, "Oh, my God, are you kidding me? Holy shit!" Just like looking at that. And then I kept giggling because it was so utterly mind-blowing. I was like, "How is this even possible that I could see this? That was impossible." But there it was. AUBREY: There it was. And then so realizing that somehow that we're these vessels, and this perfect process exists, partaking in the vessel of another, kind of code vehicle seemed to no longer be bullshit. CORY: Right, right. It's like that's going be okay. It's a container for the... AUBREY: Yeah, what really matters is the code, but you can't eat. And you're not going to eat that unless you're the Highlander, and you're absorbing cow wendigo. CORY: If you're eating code, you're doing some [inaudible 12:08]. AUBREY: We've gone way too deep if we're eating anybody's code. CORY: Like Pac Man style. AUBREY: Serial code eater. CORY: No good. AUBREY: Right on. So, let's back it up a little bit. You've never done ayahuasca before. And I invite you on this crazy journey to Gandalf, you're immediately like, "Yeah, let's fucking, let's do this." CORY: Why would anyone say no. AUBREY: So, lead us through kind of the experience, as far as some expectations, and then through some of the journeys. Let's tell some stories. CORY: Sure, sure. So, after you asked me to go, I was super pumped, ready to do it, and was happy to jump in there. And, I didn't really have any anxiety about it, or worry about the whole thing. Mainly, I just had to think through the process of getting there. That was my main thing. Okay, take a flight to Peru, which no big deal. But then taking an internal Peruvian flight to another city, and then taking a bus to a river and taking a boat into the middle of the jungle, it took a couple of days of processing. I was like, okay, once I thought through it, I was like, "Oh, man, this is easy." And what I usually think with travel and it may be helpful for anyone that has like issues with travel, like if they're going somewhere crazy, like Bangkok or something where they're like, "Oh my God, how am I going to get around?" Think about how many, like, hundreds of thousands of people do that every day. It's fun, it's all good. So, anyway, I got there and was super pumped and happy to meet Don Howard. What can I say, man? What can I say? He's quite an amazing spirit, among many other things. From what I learned, he's a master of masters. AUBREY: Well said. CORY: And, it was great. I think the second day was when we did our first ceremony, right? AUBREY: Yeah. Because we got there first... Yeah. First night, we're shredding leaves and pounding out ayahuasca vines. CORY: Oh, which a nice tidbit is, the first day when we got there, I think we went to the ayahuasca and helped Don Rober make some of the ayahuasca that we would have later. And we each went up to set an intention. We were each given a piece of plant. I feel like Howard was giving us particular ones for the specific person. He gave me the bobinsana plant, of course. AUBREY: And bobinsana is like a heart-opening, very friendly. Kind of like the love plant. CORY: Totally, totally. So, went up there to the pot, and was looking at it. And this is the first poltergeist thing that happened to me. As a quick pause and a quick aside, like as my personality, is I'm fiddy... 50%. I said fiddy. I'm 50% scientific materialist. AUBREY: "I'm fiddy percent scientific materialist, dawg." CORY: This is a good ramp up to what I'm about to say. I'm wearing Stan Smiths, man. I can't not say it. Anyway, 50% scientific materialist and 50% New Age spiritualist. I believe everything in a matter of percentages. AUBREY: Like 5% of people understood that, and I'm on the 95. CORY: A non-Aristotelian thought process. It's not A or B, it is A and B and a ratio in between those things. I look at all cosmic matters or things of supernatural even, or extraterrestrial in that way. I don't believe them hard, but I don't disbelieve them. I think that my instrument, my nervous system is a flimsy little broken old TV antenna that can only pick up a very tiny bit of the frequency that's going on in this universe, which that was... I was given a larger antenna. So anyway, so I just came to everything with an open mind and open heart. So, I take my plant matter, and I go up to the boiling pot, and we're supposed to set an intention. And I looked at it and breathed a little bit, breathe in some energy, breathe it towards the pot, and put my plant in, and my intention was, let me spread as much love as possible to the cosmos. Not just to people, but to some sort of bigger picture. And I looked at the pot, and as I was looking at the bubbling water, I feel like a voice, like Marcellus Wallace from "Pulp Fiction", that was what it sounded like. And it was like, as if the pot was talking to me. And in my head, I heard him go, "We bad, motherfucker. And we're going to do this smooth like." AUBREY: Which then became the theme-- CORY: That became the theme, yeah. AUBREY: The theme of the ayahuasca trip. CORY: But the cool thing about that is apart from it just being funny is that it really was where... It was like as I said, the first poltergeist moment where I was like, "Oh, wait a second. I just heard someone else's voice inside my head, and it looked like it was coming out of this pot." And I'm stone cold sober. So okay, so I was like, alright, well-- AUBREY: Okay, things are going to get weird. CORY: Yeah, I was excited. I was like, "Great!" So, my expectations were like, basically, I thought, so many people have done this, your mom has done it. I thought, let's go with it, and it's going to be all good. Yeah. And so, it was fun going into the maloca, the ceremonial maloca where I was on time. I'm never late, I'm just on time. So I go in, I'm on time. And everyone's sitting around, you sit in these... One's a larger circle, everyone's on their mat. And within that there's a smaller circle and everyone's on their mat. And then there's a ceremonial table at the head of the room. So whenever I walked in, there was just candles lit. Of course, they cut the power off and you're in the middle of the jungle, so it's complete darkness. Everyone's wearing white and sitting in a circles and lotus posture. And I'm like, "Oh, great." AUBREY: "What the hell have I got myself into?" CORY: Yeah, so when does the orgy or the suicide begin? Whatever. So, that was fun. But I sit down and... One of the most fascinating parts to me is that it's so highly ritualized, and the space is highly ritualized, the process is so highly ritualized. Everything in the space is incredibly ritualized. You have to see it, you got to be there to feel. It's the mothership. And I had one night where I was sitting there looking up, and I was thinking, "If you can't do it here, man, you can't do it anywhere." Especially with Howard and Don Rober. So, one of the most interesting things to me that continued to blow my mind was Howard, who you're calling Gandalf. He would go around to everyone and put agua de Florida on your heart and on your forehead, in your heart chakra and third eye. Before each ceremony, he would say something to you. And it never ceased to amaze me every time before every ceremony what he said to me, and I could hear him saying things to other people, the ability he had to say the perfect thing and to know exactly I guess almost the scaffolding you needed to be able to-- AUBREY: Some deep intuitive intelligence where he's like, I don't know why... You can even ask him. "I don't really know what I'm going to say. Just I have an idea and I just go with it. CORY: It's almost as if it's being channeled into you. AUBREY: Yeah, exactly. CORY: So, yeah, I mean, the first ceremony I did, my main goal was looking for confirmations, and confirmation of, in my life throughout, a lot of different psychedelic experience, and over a decade of meditation, I felt in tune with what I thought was the source already before this. I could close my eyes and see flickers of what I thought would be something like ayahuasca consciousness. I could feel energies and things moving inside my heart towards other people, I could direct those things. And I wanted to know, if, one of the things is this type of thing gets so slippery, the mastering of the ego and the moving of energies. Because you can start thinking that you're moving energy, and you're getting in touch with the source, but really that can be the highest level of ego, because you're really subjectively thinking that, but then you're believing in your own belief that you're actually doing these things, whenever really, you're just in a fantasy world, essentially. I wanted to see like, am I really feeling these things? And is my heart as open and open to other people and whatnot as I think? So, Howard comes over to me. And we didn't really talk much, like this is day two. And he comes over to me and pats me on the heart and looks at me in the eye with this amazing, deep, deep look and goes, "I see you, brother. I see you." And I was like, "Alright." And then he taps me on the chest. He goes, "You have a beautiful heart." And I was like, okay, well... Scanned my brain I guess. Or spirit more likely. I mean, the ritual with him calling everyone up one by one, you've probably covered this somewhere before. They give you what they think you need for that ceremony. I approached. My heart was not racing, but it was definitely, blood was pumping, mind was nice and awake. Went and drank and actually thought the ayahuasca tasted quite nice. It tasted kind of like cold, this doesn't sound nice, cold coffee. It tasted sort of like bitter coffee, but I like scotch and cold coffee and stuff like that. You are iced coffee, bitter coffee. AUBREY: The first time is the best it'll ever taste. CORY: Absolutely, absolutely. AUBREY: It's an old saying, but it's definitely true. CORY: I described it to my brother as like, let's say you drink Don Julio 1942 one night, and it is amazing. But you drink, like I don't know, half a bottle and then you puke your guts up. And then two nights later, someone's like, "Hey, drink another half a bottle of 1942." And you're like, "Okay," and you drink it and you finish the bottle, and then you puke your guts up. And then the next night, someone's like, "Hey, how about another half a bottle of tequila?" And you're like, "God, no!" And no matter what it tastes like, if it's the impetus for you puking your guts up, you're not going to like it. AUBREY: Indeed. CORY: So, anyway, so I drank it, went and sat down, didn't even wash my mouth out. And I started feeling after 10, 20 minutes the gravity shifting and that kind of psychedelic force coming. And I felt comfortable with it, felt good. And then they started blowing the candles out, ceremonial, one by one. Each one of those. And when there was one candle left, I started going, hmm, that little light is like, that's my basis for like, time and space. AUBREY: Uh-oh, what happens when they blow that one out? CORY: Exactly. So they did and, I felt the ascension take place slowly and steadily. And, it was great. I mean, it felt warm, it felt welcomed, it felt very natural to me, very like just homey and like comfortable. And started getting a lot of interesting visions there. And I guess it's so hard to describe what the visions are like unless you've actually done it. I mean, I'd read a ton of things about it before and like you can't really know it, but I suppose it's like... I mean, they say it's like lucid dreaming, I guess it's like that. Sort of, but it's like seeing... AUBREY: I feel like lucid dreaming, though, you're generally confined to constructs that your conscious mind can think of. But the shit you see there you're like, "Whoa, that's a never-ending floating mass of snakes and feathers and light and energy and mandalas." CORY: I didn't see that one. AUBREY: Yeah, I saw that one a lot. CORY: Yeah, yeah. It was like a doorway. Like it opens your mind to this other dimension. But I was still very aware that was where I was as far as being in a room. And my vision's like, I could open my eyes even though it's pitch black, but if there was little flickers of light here or there, I could see... They would kind of like mix with my normal vision. Sometimes it would mingle. So I got a lot of interesting visions that first night. And one of the things that happened, the most I guess, relevant thing, was that I felt like if there was like a softball in the middle of my chest, it just like... And that was my heart chakra, like expanded like two or three inches. Like it ripped open. And I could feel like energy in there. And all the things I saw were what I had been seeing before I came there, but just in a much more intense level. And so I thought, wow, okay, I can feel my heart, I felt it open, and I could see those things that I was seeing, but just on a much deeper level. So I thought, cool, there's my confirmation essentially. Oh, and also the nausea of course, fighting with that. That was pretty challenging. It's like if you drank a whole bunch of alcohol, and then you're like throwing up at four in the morning, and you're like, "Oh, God!" You're hanging on but you're like, "Why the fuck did I drink so much? I'm such an idiot." I did have that thought of like, "Why did I drink so much ayahuasca? I'm such an idiot. Oh God. What am I doing?" But then that passed. The Icaros, it would almost feel like someone turned on a ceiling fan, like blow some of that nausea away, or would make it come up. There's a couple of times-- AUBREY: They'd move it around. CORY: Start jamming out. [inaudible 26:03] well, my vomit just took the elevator to the top floor. So, the second experience ever-- AUBREY: So, let me tell the second experience from my vantage point. CORY: Please, please. AUBREY: I get through and I already told this story a little bit, but it's like this deeply introspective kind of soulful, eye-opening journey where I was looking at some of my deepest shadows, and knowing that I had to confront them later. But I was just kind of on the hunt, and just very kind of soulful, almost had a melancholy like, here I am on the hunt, that I didn't even know I have to chase this giant shadow down. So, I grab my flute and I'm still kind of in the medicine, and I go up to the sky deck all by myself in the dark, and the stars are there. And I start playing a soulful tune.
CORY: Keep in mind that the star deck, the star deck is like, it's in the jungle. It exceeds the limits of the property.AUBREY: Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, it's like far away from everybody. And I'm just like playing my most soulful, soulful tunes on my Native American flute. And then I hear someone from down underneath the hill going, "Prangi! Prangi!" And Prangi is this other musician that we had with us. I was like, "What the hell is that?" CORY: And to your credit, he's Brazilian. AUBREY: He's Brazilian, yeah. He's Brazilian. So, I was like, "They can't confuse me for him because I suck, and he's really good," but I was like, "Maybe he is calling for me." So, I look down there and there's Cory, just barefoot, and I could just see your eyes glowing like a wild animal that you see, startled in the brush. I was like, "Whoa, he's got a crazy look in his eyes." And he's like, "Hey, oh, Aubrey, whoa!" He's like, "Oh, do you have a light?" And I happen to have a flashlight. So I was like, "Yeah, yeah, I got a light." He's like, "Okay, I want to come up." So, I shine the light on him. And there's two ways to approach this star deck. One is up this giant hill, which is like at such a savage incline. Like, only a ridiculous wild animal would try to climb that. And then there's this kind of winding walkway that goes up. So, Cory, just goes straight for the star deck, right? So, I see him, he gets down on all four, nails digging into the dirt. Like feet, like claws, just pawing at clumps of grass, like getting thrown and strewn about. Just this full werewolf mode, climbing up to the top of the star deck. And you get up, and you're like buzzed. You're like someone hit you with like a lightning bolt. Just like vibrating. It's like, whoa, holy shit! CORY: An alien boarded my ship. AUBREY: Exactly. And you start telling me some of the story about, first, how the food was amazing, I had to come find it. But check this out. And so that's how I heard this first story that you're about to hear. That was the setting. CORY: This time, so this is just like a Tarantino movie. Now this is the end, we'll come back to the beginning. So I'll tell this with 2% of the enthusiasm I told you that time. I was already saying, we were joking about me being like Doc from "Back to the Future." I was like, "Marty, I went to the future." AUBREY: Totally. CORY: "We need fuel." So basically, that second ceremony, I went in, and I was in the zone. I felt so good. I felt ready. Because now I'd tested the water. I'd felt what it was like to experience it, and I was ready. I was ready to go deep. And went in there. And I don't even know, that's not my personality. I go in there to... I'm on time again. And everyone's already in there. I walk over. Like Prangi, our friend we talked about. I walked over and he just stood up as I walked by, and looked at me. And I gave him a hug and kissed him on the side of the face, which I mean, I'm happy to hug him but I'm not a type that goes around just kissing people on the side of the face. And of course he's a sweetie, so he was like, "Oh, thanks." He was happy to receive that. I went over to Olivia, your little sister, and kind of gave her a kiss on top of the head and said like, again, I don't know why, but I said, "Good luck." And I went and sat down. I just felt so like in the zone. Like it was top meditations like zen mode. I was just dialed in. So, I'm sitting there, I'm just ready, I'm full of energy already, just vibrating. I was like, I want a giant cup. They call me up. I go up there. And this time instead of kind of scooting my little feet up to the altar, this time I'm swaggering it up there, man. Looks like Miles Davis walking out to Carnegie Hall, man. I'm just ready. And they give me the cup, and I just feel the highest level of meditative energy, the highest zone I can get. I felt I was in there. And whenever I get to that zone, I kind of like, have them with playing music too, where I'll kind of almost be looking out into space or something but I can start seeing through the... I guess I stopped using my eyes per se and started tuning right into the head. I got that instantly when I walked up there. I downed the cup and looked at their eyes, Howard and Don Rober, and enjoyed the reflection. They looked pleased with my state of mind. I go, I sit down. I start breathing and Howard comes over and gives us the agua de Florida, and the sang beforehand. And this time puts his hand on my shoulder and gives me this this kind of shiny eyed look, and just goes, "Cory..." and then walks off. AUBREY: Enough said. CORY: I guess he must feel the juice flowing, yeah. So, not 20 minutes probably into the ceremony, I feel like a meteor just hit me in the chest. Just bang, right? And it was my heart chakra just like ripping open, and just blue light just exploded at my chest. And the area around that felt like it was like a crater that was like smoking and searing with like red, like comet, magma or something. And it's just like searing there, and then light is just exploding on my chest. And I was like, "Oh, fuck." And actually grabbed my chest like this, it was like, "Oh!" Because I just felt like my torso could rip apart. There was so much blue light just blowing out of there. So that went on for a while. AUBREY: How many times has that happened to you, Orlando? CORY: Every Thursday at 4:00 p.m. So, I'm sitting there going, "Oh, fuck." So, that went on for quite a while. And then I start seeing this tube, right? And I'm like looking at it. I'm like, alright, chest is still exploding. And that becomes a theme throughout all my ceremonies. And so, then I start thinking, that's a tube, I need to go down that tube, right? So, I start trying to go down this tube I'm seeing. And I'm kind of having a hard time. I'm sort of treading space time. And then I see Howard, he appears like in my vision. Like whipping a cow, he goes, "Find it, brother! Find it! And I was like, "Alright, I'm going to find it." And I start going down there. And then ayahuasca starts showing me things to try and scare me off the path. It shows me like, like a giant snake or like a bug that's like two inches away from my eyeball. Or like her face, she looks like Angelina Jolie, but like it morphs into the skull preacher from "Beetlejuice" or something. I just kept laughing because I'm like, "You're not going to fucking scare me." Like, you can do anything you want. You can show piranhas eating my eyeballs and I just don't care. And they would like laugh at me, like it was being playful, like it would giggle. And then I would start going down the tube some more, and then it would go, "How about this? How about this? Does this scare? How about some nausea?" And I would go like, "No, bitch." I could feel the vines like creeping up my chest, and I would prune it back down with my mind. And I would be like, "You're not going to get down the tube." And I said, "You know what, I don't care if I do anything else this entire night. I got all night. I'm getting to the bottom of that fucking tube. I don't care what you say, I'll be here until the morning. I don't care." So I'm trudging down there. So then I think, "Oh, I should grow wings." So, sensible thing to think, right? So, these wings just rip out on my back and I start flying down this tube. And then I'm meeting a bit of traction again. And so, then I think I see a bunch of loved ones very close to me, appear in front of me. And Howard is among them. And they all go and morph into my wings, my wings become gigantic. And so, like their consciousness are in these wings. And I'm like flying and soaring down this tube. A lot of other twists and turns, I finally get to the bottom. And that's where... Oh, well, at one point, a giant eagle comes and looks at me in the face and goes, "You're an eagle." And I was like, "No, I'm not, get out of my way." And I keep flying. The Giant Eagle head comes back and he's like, "You're an eagle." And I was like, "No, I'm not. Out of my way." So, then I go on this thing, and I morph myself into this beautiful white feathered beast looking thing. And then the eagle comes back and goes, "No, man, you're an eagle." And I was like, o, yeah, that beautiful white-feathered beast thing, that's vanity, that's spiritual vanity. I'm not that thing, that's trying to be unique or pleasing to the eye. I was like, "Yeah, I'm an eagle." So whenever I thought that, the eagle head that was looking at me, reverses and goes, shoot, and sticks into my third eye. So I have like an eagle's head coming out of my third eye. And so, I'm flying down this tube, right? Whenever that happened, my heart opening exploded again, and I got this crazy wave of energy. And I hear this voice from wherever, infinity goes, "Now you know what fierce love feels like." I was just sitting there like... My focus was crazy. That's whenever my crazy animalize that you saw kicked in was because my focus was five dimensional, right? So, I get to the bottom of this tube. And it's like, you're an eagle, you've got the eagle coming out of your third eye. AUBREY: You're ready to find something. CORY: Yep. And that's when I see the source. It goes, here's the source, there's the source code. And then all the stuff I explained earlier about that. There's a couple of different little subtleties about that. I was talking to the source, I asked it my purpose, why it was showing me all this and so forth. And it told me that I had been outsourced by the source, and my function in life was to be a mirror. So, I worked for the source and I should be a mirror so other people can see the source within themselves. And it said that's how you can be of service, is just continue your existence and people will catch a glimpse of the reflection of their source within you. And it will basically get them on the path of their own. So, I thought okay, cool. I can do that. So, then I started thinking like, how can I move energy and feed it back to the grid? And it goes, "Blow it up the chimney," right? So through my giant heart opening, I start breathing in the energy, taking it up to my eagle third eye, eagle head. And then instead of normally pushing it back out of my heart, which I would do in a meditation, I push it off the top of my head. And I'd never done that before. I could feel... Really, if you're constipated and you feel yourself taking a bad... That's kind of gross. Feel yourself taking a shit. it's kind of like that same weird sluggy movement moving through the back of my head, and then just goes off the top of my head, right? I was shitting love out of the top of my head. AUBREY: Just clearing up some gunk, probably. CORY: Well, no, it was going back into the source, right? And so, that went on for a while. It goes, this is your instrument, play your instrument. So I was like, alright. So, it was like, I was doing work, was breathing that in and pushing all this out the source. So, I'm leaving out of course, a lot of detail for time, and it was so, just mind-blowing and intense that I felt like tapped out. And I remember saying to ayahuasca, like look, I think you might have told me too much. I can't remember all this. Thank you so much, but I can't remember. I'm afraid I'm going to forget stuff. And he goes, "Do you want to know more?" I was like, "Well, I mean, yeah, but I mean, I'm already worried I'm going to forget what I've already been told." Like, as if the room was cut in half, it opens like an industrial elevated door, and then closes. And it was sort of like an Apple screensaver, like the default one, like the little multicolored lights. It was like that in there. And it was like, "Are you sure?" I was like, "Well, fuck it. Let's do it. I'm here, let me see it." So, I'm sitting there. I start looking around, and everyone starts looking like they're covered in like a candy shell or something, right? And I'm like, wow, okay, that's cool. I look at one person, and it looks like their body is covered in like hundreds of gallons of Vaseline, like some bad Matthew Barney installation. AUBREY: I don't know what that is, but I have a fucking great idea. CORY: He's an artist. So, I'm looking at this person. And this like white tube comes out of this pile of Vaseline, and it's waving in front of my face. I'm looking at it, and I'm like, I should go In there. And so I got the eagle eye, comes on, the wings are out. AUBREY: You just see a hole and you want to go in. CORY: That's right, no time to waste. So, I go-- AUBREY: "Wait, a hole? I'm in, I'm in, let's go. Let's plunge at first. CORY: Yeah, eagle costume on. Roleplaying, baby. So, I go flying in there. And there's like all these conduits like in the shape of diamonds, right? Like geometric conduit. So, I'm flying around these conduits. And I see this black stuff around one of the connection points. And I start like ripping at it. My hand looks like an eagle claw. I'm looking at it. And in real life, I'm actually scratching my leg like this. But I feel like I'm scratching this black matter, right? And I feel like I'm pecking at it with my beak. And I'm tearing this stuff off and throwing it out of this tube. And after I ripped it all off, there's just like red pulpy stuff that was there. It looked like something injured. And it said something to me, like a topic about what that was about. And then I thought, uh-oh, I should get out of here. So I fly out of there. Other interesting thing happened that night. A lot of interesting stuff. AUBREY: And obviously you're not mentioning who it is, and what the specifics are because it's private information. But that really seems like what some of the shamanic path would be. It would be finding these things about people. Oh, what's the root cause of this? And then if you can energetically or even through words or love or whatever, you want to alter that. Just be like, hey, I see this is hurting, let's see if we can fix this. CORY: Totally. And it's giving them the space to be able to fix it for themselves. AUBREY: Yeah, totally. CORY: So, that was interesting. AUBREY: So, don't show any holes or tombs to Cory unless you want him to fly in there. CORY: Zip right in there. In an eagle costume. So, I told all this to my mom, by the way, and she was kind of paying attention, and then laughing afterwards. She said when I was a little kid that we went to this place where there was Native Americans selling these... My family's got some Native American. And they were selling a bunch of little figurines and whatnot. And apparently, I was obsessed with and picked this man in the eagle costume. And just, I kept it in my room for a long time when I was a little kid, which is kind of a fun connection. So, fast forward to the third ceremony. Again, another heart opening at the beginning. It felt like my heart like ripped to the sides of my chest this time, a bunch of other interesting stuff. So, I get to the, let's say the fourth ceremony. Now, I'm just ready to rock, right? I mean I already was, but fourth ceremony, I was so, so ready. It was like I was going to an amusement park. I was like, "Okay, let's play." So, I go in there and-- AUBREY: This is such a stark contrast to where I was. I'm like crawling, barely alive. I was like, "Please don't make me drink it again." CORY: Well, hey man, I guess it's the scales. I guess someone's got to have that experience-- AUBREY: Gives you what you need, man. This experience you're talking about, that was my second and third sessions. CORY: With my kids, I'll just never do it again. So they don't have-- AUBREY: I don't know, man. For you, it might be like that every time. I could never know. CORY: I'll let everybody know. So, the fourth one, I get in there, I'm just ready. And Howard goes up to me and he goes, "I'm going to show you that less is more." And he goes, "If you pay attention to the teachings, you'll be able to see this without drinking anything at all." And I was like, "Okay." And then while he was down there, I said, "Hey, I just wanted to thank you for everything." Keep in mind, people listening, that all throughout the days that we were there, all the off days, we're with Howard, we're talking to him as friends. And also he's sharing his perspective and just awakened mind with us, his time and space. He's one of those guys that has his own time zone when you're around him, you're sharing, all that. So there's a lot more than just the ceremonies. So I said, just thank you so much for being an amazing mentor during all this. I said, I've had maybe one other one in my life like this. And he laughed and said, "Choose wisely." And I just said, "I don't know what I can do to repay you but thank you so much." And he said, "The feeling's mutual" And I was like, "That's interesting." All right, cool. So I go up, and there was barely anything in the cup, whenever I went to drink. I drank it, no one sat down. And oh my God, 10, 20 minutes, whatever it was. Okay, so the previously mentioned chest hole, say you had a beach ball in your chest, and it was your torso, and it was like concrete in the space where the hole wasn't missing. So, below your abdomen, up over your shoulders, like a tank top or something. That area just melted away. It was like shattering rock. And my entire torso from my waist to my neck just exploded into a river of multicolored lights. It was just gushing. It was like, if you took a brick out of a dam. So much so that my entire body was vibrating. I was like trying to breathe. AUBREY: You're like, "Quick, I'm vibrating. Find a hole." CORY: Yeah, everyone hop on. I saw another animal during that, which was a serpent. It's a bit... We don't have time for me to go into [inaudible 45:49] but a lot of interesting good things with the serpent. Clearing other people's energies and chakra centers with this, like, in command, with the serpent during that, which is very interesting. But apart from the gushing rivers of love and energy that was coming out of me. And I could see it was like "The Shining" where the elevator doors open and the blood comes out. But it's multicolored light and it was like washing inside of the ceremonial maloca, just up the walls everywhere. Soaking everyone, right? And I started looking around. I was looking at people, and when I mentioned this to you about you is like, I was just kind of looking at people doing that. I looked at you, and I started seeing like someone throwing down a bunch of Polaroids. I was like seeing Aubrey as a kid, Aubrey having this experience, him having this... And I was like, I wasn't there for any of these. It's him as a child. And I'd look at someone else and I'd see these other experience, people I'd never met from the other side of the world, seeing experiences. Like someone just throwing down a bunch of Polaroids. Then I heard someone say, "Cory!" And I was like, what? And I looked over who it was, and they didn't really say it, but I heard their voice like in that psychic space. I looked at him and I look, and I'd see this black stuff around them, and I would just kind of look at it. And it would disappear, like it would crumble up and like go away. And I was like, "That's interesting." And it kept happening. I'd hear someone else say, "Cory!" "What?" I'd look over there, and I'd see this black stuff and it would just crumble and go away. So, then I kind of sat back and I started seeing it just coming out of everyone, like this black like... I don't know how to describe. Almost like silly putty or something but more like calcified. It's rising up out of people. I'm seeing all sorts of crazy. I was seeing people's souls rise out of their body, and just float above them and stuff. And I could see their lives and things, and like moving the snake like through their bodies and all that stuff. I mean, seeing the souls levitate out of their body is something that like, it actually kind of fucks with me still. Like it's still, that's the one image that I'm like, I almost can't even process it. River of mandalas is one thing, but seeing souls lift out of people's bodies, and then their history... So, I'm sitting there looking at all this stuff. And then I look and I noticed that all of the black stuff is also like, it's vanishing. And I look up and I see Howard sitting at the front of the ceremony space, and he's kind of just looking left and right slowly. And as he's doing it, those energies, or that black stuff is vanishing. And I was like, "Oh, that's what he's doing up there." Because he's just tending the garden with no effort, just like a pure straight up gangster. Just laying it down. And then I look at Don Rober. And he looks like a Byzantine painting, he's just gold, and there's gold light. Like his chest is a doorway, and there's just like gold flowing. I mean, it looks like he's like floating, right? So, then I start feeling this negative force, which is the first time I felt anything really negative in there. But it felt like it was outside of the maloca. And it was like coming up behind me. And you all who haven't heard before, there's these things called mapachos, which are like, I guess cigarettes, essentially. But it's just tobacco, natural tobacco rolled and smoked, used for-- AUBREY: Different species, that goes down there in South America, yeah. CORY: So, they use those a lot incessantly during the ceremonies. They light them and they do this thing that they go, which is them moving energy, clearing it is what they would say. Or they'd use it to set an intention and so forth. So, I'm sitting there, it's pitch black, I'm feeling this negative force and I start going uh-oh. I actually kind of got up and looked out the window a little bit to see if I could see anything, and there was nothing out there. But I felt this daunting force coming. And I started thinking like, uh-oh, I should probably try, I got to do something about this. So I start breathing in. I still got the river of energy flowing out of me, but I think I'm going to try and breathe in something and make this thing go away. Try and tame this thing that's coming. So, as I'm trying to put this plan together, I like breathe in, I'm like, "Alright, here we go." And then Don Rober, just like an Old West, like a cowboy, lights one of the mapachos. And the thing just disappeared. It was like Billy the Kid, like bam. And I was like, "Dude, are you kidding me?" And then, yeah, there's so much more to tell. I saw hundreds of gods, I talked to a bunch of different species of gods that looked like Thundercats. AUBREY: Nice! Thundercat gods, I didn't even hear that story. CORY: Yeah, well, there's so much on that fourth ceremony, I couldn't even start to-- AUBREY: Have you written it down or anything? CORY: What's that? AUBREY: Have you written it down or anything? CORY: I did audio diaries of each one the night of, before I went to bed so it was all fresh. Yeah, apparently my folks looked like Panthro, I think Panthro in his name. The blue guy from... AUBREY: I dressed up as Tygra one year. CORY: Oh, nice. Nice. AUBREY: For sure. It was stellar, we had the full cats. Cheetara, Lion-O, Panthro. CORY: Boom. AUBREY: Boom, Thundercats. CORY: The amazing thing about it, one of the things, to get back to the poltergeist stuff that challenges the scientific materialist part of my mind is, I mentioned those experiences of looking at people, hearing them call my name, or seeing things about their life. And I kind of casually said, "Hey, maybe this is just the ayahuasca talking, but it's too cool for me not to mention that I saw this and this and this." And people were like, "What the fuck? I had that experience as a kid and I was thinking about that." Or "I did think about you during the experience. I was asking you to like come over and l don't know, almost wanted you to sit by me or something during the ceremony. And I was thinking about you." And those are the people that I heard call my name. AUBREY: Well, I know for me, you mentioned all those Polaroids. For some reason, I didn't even mention this in my solo cast, because it wasn't that significant for me. But I had this full recounting of my whole childhood and life and I mentioned to you. So, I was like, all of these old memories, I was just basically like looking through my old memory photo album, just kind of browsing, scanning. Going, "Oh yeah, I remember that." "Oh, I remember that. That was gone. I totally forgot about that." And I was just going through the whole thing. CORY: It's so creepy, I'm like, yeah, "Wasn't that a nice memory?" Arm on the shoulder. AUBREY: Like, wait a minute. Did I invite you to go look at his memory book or did you just come-- CORY: Apparently. You opened the door, homie. AUBREY: I made the hole. CORY: Yeah, and I zipped right in there. AUBREY: Well, man. CORY: In a crotchless eagle costume, came flying right in. AUBREY: We're going to have to get into some more details of the Thundercat gods. CORY: Oh, for sure. AUBREY: Some more of that, more to come. Well, Cory my brother, it's been awesome. CORY: Yeah, we had a great time down there. It was great. And it was great seeing different sides, I think both of us. It was really fun being down there and just get to see other sides of each other, and like the amount of... Talk about putting your coat up at the door, man. Hanging your meat body up at the door and going into the party, as just a piece of mandala code in a little container. AUBREY: You think you're going to go down there and hide something, forget it. I mean, you can wear, close the cover of your genitals, but that's like the most coverage you're going to get. Period. Everything else is going to come out. So, it's quite a ritual. CORY: And for anyone listening, I can't recommend it enough. I mean, there's a lot of... I mean, some people were more prepared than others, I think. Some people are more... However much spiritual work I think you've done and not phony holy stuff but real, authentic nuts and bolts spiritual work you've done, I think will have something to do with it, how clean your castle is. I think if you have the courage to be willing to drink it, then you're ready because that's all it takes is it takes open heart, open mind, and the courage to want to grow and know more. And if you have all of that, then the cosmic world is yours. AUBREY: It's going to do its mood light, because it's bad, motherfucker. CORY: Yes, it is. AUBREY: Cory, my man. You're a bad motherfucker as well. Thank you for stopping by, brother. Hit them one more time with your contact info, and we'll wrap this bitch up. CORY: Oh, yes. Twitter's @QuietDesign, which I'm actually thinking about changing that. So if anyone has any good ideas, let me know. And then my website is-- AUBREY: Heart Gape. CORY: Heart Goats. Don't Google goats. Yeah, so cory-allen.com. That's the website. So, there it is. AUBREY: Don't sleep on heart gape, Cory. CORY: So inspired. AUBREY: You're going to register before me. I do like it. CORY: Yeah. AUBREY: Alright, my brother. Catch up another time soon, man. I'm gone for a few days, but let's go grab some dinner next week. CORY: Let's do it. AUBREY: And to you, my lovelies. Thanks for tuning in one more time, and we're back again soon. Peace.